How long were you the Soundman for Ubu? From when to when?

I was the sound man from 75/80.

What did your duties include out on tour?

As far as what my duties went it was all the normal stuff. Just the sound and lugging gear, crowd control, groupies--all the normal stuff. There wasn't much to do in terms of groupies and crowd control so my duties were limited in that regard. I also had to take care of Scott's dry cleaning (he had an extensive wardrobe) and keep the dogs from attacking David in front of Kentucky Fried Chicken.

What inspired you to do this?

As in everything Ubu, it was always changing. If I remember correctly Tom Herman called me when I was living I Philadelphia and asked if I would work with Ubu as a soundman. I had known all involved one way or another and had heard the singles and always thought they were an important band. I was aware of everyone's influences and knew it would be interesting. Plus David was a chick magnet and I knew there would be a lot of overflow. The scene in Cleve and everywhere else in the world at the time were such that there was only a few bands that were making any kind of statement and these guys were always fun. So off to Cleve I went. That was the period of Peter, Tim. We would camp out at different people apartments and lofts when we would go out and I remember being afraid to take off my boots one night for the fear they wouldn't be there when I woke. It was always an adventure when we would travel.

What struck you about hearing Ubu on album after hearing them so often live? How do you think the albums relate to the live band?

Ubu live to my thinking was always more important. The studio really didn't represent them well. You know, stuff like Allen's synth just going off so loud that the Paradiso in Amsterdam just shook. Its was an amazing thing. It was like an earthquake, just amazing. Or Tom changing the beginning of a song and transforming the whole feel of it. Sometimes we would go to gigs and no one would show. There would be 2 people in the club. Snow would be so deep, the only way to get to the gig was by fourwheel drive. It was always an adventure.
      The band never sounded that good in the studio. I mean it could have been better, sonically. It never reached the sort of peaks I always expected. When you consider the sort of bands the Ubus liked it just didn't peak in my estimation. As I said before Ubu was one of the most important bands of the 70's but couldn't sell an album to save its life I am not sure why that was. But then again I couldn't understand why Sun Ra wasn't huge. Maybe one reason was that Ubu never really toured like a working band a little here and a little there but never really beat down any doors. They would play hot spots like MAX'S or CBGB'S but never with any regularity. Not like the Pirates cove But that was once a week. Most bands go out and are gone for months. That wasn't Ubu's m.o. Ubu was more terrorist or guerrilla raids into enemy territory.

I'm told you have a great bear story.

David and I were flying along the highway one time and we are chatting away. David was telling me about being an avid camper and loving the outdoors. This in itself was distracting enough, let alone a bear running into a fence on the side of the road. I didn't think it was going to make it over so I didn't slow down but I did move to the left side of the road. To my surprise it made it over the fence and was heading right for us and all of a sudden he was attacking us. He went for the trailer first and that was his mistake. I didn't hit him, he hit me broadside. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.
     By the time he woke up we were gone. He did wake up---we saw him run across the road.

You mentioned shows with Devo a couple of times---could talk a little more about these shows?

The Devo shows I mentioned before were always a great time. They were very funny guys. You either loved them for what they were or you hated them. People would either get verbally abusive or they would be laughing there asses off. I always had a good time watching them. I love Bob Motherbaugh's guitar playing. He would solo and just kill the crowd. He would jump into the audience and play. It was great. Very animated.

You also mentioned the Ubu's influences. What do you see as the influences on each of the band members?

I can only speak to a few influences I am sure of.
     Scott was into r&b, jazz, classical, velvet underground, Miles Davis, anything with a huge groove. Scott's present band is so far beyond anything thats out there now. I guess tricky is the closest comparable .The labels are scared of it.
     David is into the beach boys and all sorts of garage stuff.
     Tony was into James Brown any R&B stuff Tony is my favorite bass player of all time. He can do anything. He can get into any groove you throw at him.
     I can only speak to Allen's influences in a small way. I know he likes the Beach Boys and Miles for sure.

By the dates you gave me, you were doing sound at the Pirate's Cove. Those seem to have been formative shows in many ways---what do you remember about them?

The things I remember about the PCove dates were the lack of audience. In the beginning a dozen or less would show up. We knew all by name; it was a strange thing. Then as I said it got bigger but still not as many as you would expect. It was a great place and will always be remembered fondly. One time at the sound check David had to grab an older middle age man from messing around with the PA gear. He wanted to talk into a mic. He was there with his wife and another couple and wanted to talk over the PA. David grabbed him he didn't know what was going on he was so drunk. All he knew was a huge man had wrapped his arms around his chest and that he was helpless to break away. David just said we spend a lot of money on this stuff don't touch it.

It sounds like you saw a lot of early songs develop. Any favorites or big shifts in direction that you found interesting?

Final solution was one such song. Tom had changed the whole feel at CBGB's with a volume pedal it was the strongest I had ever heard it I don't know if it stayed that way because I left right after that tour.

You stopped doing sound for Ubu sometime after Tom Herman left. What made you decide to leave? And what did you notice changing in the band when you were on your way out? And what specifically did you see shifting with Mayo Thompson on board?

I left Ubu just before Tom did.
     Mayo added a lot to the band. I don't know if it was better but it was different. I saw them at a small club in Cleve and enjoyed it. The sound was a lot better with me not doing it I recall.
     With Mayo it was thinner than when Tom played. Tom took a lot of space with his playing. Took charge so to speak.

Have you seen any tours by the reformed Ubu? What are your impressions?

I haven't seen the new Ubu but I'm sure its good.

Any thoughts on Rocket from the Tombs? It seems like a very odd mixture of personalities, judging by what they respectively went on to do later.

Well Rockets was an odd bunch of wannabe's it was a cover band for the most part playing cover music clubs. But it was an interesting cover band.